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Anne Higonnet, "Photographs Against the Law"
Hilarie Claire Tomasiewicz
-"Modern art purports to intervene in politics and society, and thereby
courts political and social counter-attack." (169) Is the body of a naked
child really so crucial to the "purported" purpose of modern art? Is it
un-American to sacrifice some of an artist's right to use photographs
of naked children in order to be sure that ALL children are protected
by law?
- Should i feel ashamed to consider myself un-American with respect to
this issue?
Char DeCroos
-Would Malinowski's Trobrianders consider photographs of thier children
naked (and not involved in sexual acts) in a negative light. Obviously
in Trobriand society adults still have authority over thier children,
allowing for abuse of adult authority, but would the differing perspective
on childhood innocence elimate any controversy regarding the depiction
of naked children?
Walter Dan Stiehl
-With the witch hunt surrounding any image of a nude child, has Higonnet
faced any legal action for this article in which there are photos of nude
children, including Rosie which was not displayed in London because of
the reaction it would have brought forth?
David Spitz
-Higonnet reminds us that pictures, even photos, are ideas and not in
themselves "real." In light of today's increasingly media-savvy audiences,
and the growing awareness of digital manipulation, do we agree that the
general public still has trouble making the distinction between phantasm
and reality?
Max Bajracharya
-A person looking at an image of a child might have feelings of warmth
or sympathy or disgust...the line is fuzzy of course, even to each individual.
By evolution, this seems like a fine balance of love for the child (future
population) and protection of it (animals love/protect their young)...but
how does adding a conscious layer of morals which is constantly changing
as shown by the laws effect this balance?
Joseph Kaye
-Why is child pornography such a sexy topic for discussion and legal
action? Both essays point out that far, far more children are injured
by physical and mental abuse of an entirely non-sexual nature, and yet
these cases receive far less attention.
Mike Ananny
-How can both the adult's right to expression and the child's right to
safety be protected simultaneously? Higonnet argues that this compromise
lies in the description of what is real or imagined in photographs. Are
photographs targetted because they usually mediate real events? What if
a photograph were constructed and digitally created to look exactly like
a real photograph, implying realism; would this still be considered pornography?
I.e. is the event of capturing the image (and knowledge that the scene
actually existed at some point in time) the offensive aspect or is the
simple illusion of reality good enough for the classification of pornography?
What if the painter/sculptor had a specific child in mind as he created
the image of a nude child? Would it then be pornography by extension because
a real figure was part of the creation process?
-Is child pornography really another example of adult ideas of sexuality
being applied to children? Perhaps a child can never give informed consent
for a picture that will be evaluated in the context of adult sexuality
because he/she cannot yet fully understanding the concept of adult sexuality?
I.e. perhaps the debate about child pornography is misplaced because the
pictures of children-as-sexual-objects are being evaluated in relation
to adult sexuality and not child sexuality. Would this be less of an issue
if children's own sexuality were recognized as a form of its own worthy
of expression and exploration?
Anindita Basu
-What is the difference between a nude painting and a photograph?
It's a bit disturbing that photography can be censored for a lot of images
that would be accepted in painting or sculpture. Is it that many of the
photos are being taken in current society and the paintings were acceptable
in the society in which they were created and passed down as acceptable,
or is it something intrinsic to our notions of photography?
-Who is considered to be a child in child pornography cases? For abuse
and assault, it's anyone under the age of 18. Many "children" by the under
18 standards are already having consentual sex and have reached sexual
maturity. Are they still considered to be incapable of giving consent
to photographs?
-Doesn't child pornography need to be fought to a certain extent as a
movement for social change (as in the photographs themselves and not just
the actions represented within them)? From a feminist standpoint, there
are many images of women in the media which suggest that men have certain
rights towards women depending on clothing, etc.... women are objectified.
Is this also happening with children to a certain extent through media
images that aren't pornographic images of actions? The "norms" and expectations
of a society don't always coincide with legality.
(As a side note about the extremeties to which people will go when dealing
with childhood sexuality-- did you hear about the case a few years ago
in which a six-year old boy was suspended from school for sexual harassment
because he kissed a classmate?)
Jeannie R. Ben-Hain
-The statement that "exhibtion of the genitals does not require that the
genitals be visible" really bothers me. Does this mean that any pictures
of people that show any part of someone below the waist are considered
pornography? I was also really surpised by the Senate's censure regarding
the Knox trial. I mean how often does the Senate agree about anything
100 to 0???
Carlos Cantu
-It's interesting to see how the backlash against permissiveness that
Jenkins refers to in his article is still being felt some 30 years later
and to a greater extent. But what happens to the kids growing up in a
society still trying to come to terms with their own erotic feelings and
impulses? Shouldn't we, as a country, concern ourselves more with perpetuating
nature of this type of behavior? If kids grow up thinking that their bodies
are "bad" aren't those guilty feelings going to foster more child molesters?
Oh, and if Knox pictures were being deemed pornographic merely because
they were representations, what's next?
Brandy Evans
-She repeatedly states how much money and resources go toward preventing
child pornography that could be put to use against child abuse, but I
didn't see anywhere where she actually states dollar amounts (maybe I
just missed it?) which makes me wonder how much she is exagerrating or
sensationalizing this claim. If it's not an exagerration, though, my real
questions are for our government, with regard to how they can allow that
to happen. She certainly shows that child pornography is a tiny subset
of all child abuse; I wonder if the activists she talks about realize
this.
Alexandra Andersson
-Higonnet argues against the argument that photographs of naked children
are traumatic to the children. What are the arguments presented by the
other side? I can't think of a single good argument why the mere act of
taking a picture of a naked child would be traumatic.
Girim Sung
-Higonnet wants to separate the action and image of a photograph in the
child pornography law: "Actions and images are not the same." However,
Higonnet offers a strong piece of evidence that seems to connect action
and image: "Without an exception, all of the child pornographers with
whom we came in contact were also child molesters" (Illinois Legislative
Investigating Committee). If you look at this using Vygotsky's concept
of action/meaning; couldn't it be that the meaning behind the photograph's
image led to the action of using the photographs inappropriately?
-She goes further to argues that, "the actions of making and using photographs
are real. Photographs themselves may seem convincingly real, but they
are not real." She continues to say that the "highly dubious child pornographic
logic" makes the wrong "assumption that all photographs are documents,
as opposed to representations, or forms of expression." Isn't it irrelevant
what the intention or desired purpose of the photograph is? Whether or
not these photographs are meant simply as a medium for artistic expression,
most people expect photographs to portray truth (reality), to be "convincingly
real" (not like paintings, TV, literature-things that give the expectation
of fiction and fantasy).
Raffi Krikorian
-On the one hand I can agree with Higonnet's perceived narrow focus of
child pornography laws on photographic images. Does that mean that it
would be illegal for a pedophile to depict in photos the images of children
engaged in sex acts whereas the same depiction in paint would be legal?
-However, I have a problem with her problem with the word "real" throughout.
In the photographic image, real, live children are obviously used. They
cannot be conjured in the artist's mind as they may have been for the
painter. Isn't the use of the term "real" then justified?
-Does Higonnet ever go on to lobby or propose specific legislature which
could meet the balance she proposes?
Daniel Huecker
-What might the taboo role of the voyeuristic gaze play in all of this
analysis? The camera eye stares at the body and delights in the details-
the way "brightness eddies around an otherwise almost imperceptibly swelling
breast" or the "delicate pubic tracery." Maybe it isn't the representation
of some reality in photography (actual object) but the way the lens allows
us/ forces us to take on the role of voyeur (actual looking). (?)
Jennifer Chung
-Why hasn't the government cracked down on child beauty pageants yet?
Given the apparent societal sexualization of young teenagers -- Britney
Spears, etc. -- at what age is it 'okay' for children to be considered
sex symbols? Related to that are magazines which portray pre-teens to
other pre-teens as 'hot stars' -- again, at what age are such things permissible?
Stephanie K. Dalquist
-As far as the caus-and-effect relationship between "simply... looking
at an image all by itself can make a person commit an action...", why
was this not an issue in other parts of history, when nudes have been
accepted, or even the standard, in art? Is this an after-effect of the
creation of the myth of inncoent children? Or is there something about
other forms of art that defuses the pornographic aspect of the nude?
Henry Jenkins, "The Sensuous Child: Benjamin Spock
and the Sexual Revolution"
Hilarie Claire Tomasiewicz
-In what regard, if any, are the terms "pre-war" and "post-war" significant
to understanding the causes of the major child-rearing differences specific
to each period ? Are there factors resulting specifically from the outcome
of WWII that have directly contributed to the increased "permissiveness"
of the post-war era?
Char DeCroos
-Why the heck would a world war cause a sudden upswing in "erotic urgency".
I'm really failing to see how experiencing a war/war time state could
cause an upswing in sexual experimentation after the war period itself.
Perhaps this attitide (the world could end tommorrow so why don't we ...)
originated during the war and merely carried over?
Walter Dan Stiehl
-The juxtaposition of the pre-war and post-war beliefs are amazingly different.
To what degree has this "sexual revolution" of children led to the sexual
revolution of adults? It seems as if children were brought up that nudity
was okay, then Woodstock nudity and experimentation seems almost a direct
result of it.
David Spitz
-To what extent are child-rearing customs responsible for generational
character (eg, "spoiled brats who never had a good spanking")? Does child-rearing
create culture, or is it the other way around? What is the character and
custom of the post-Spock generation?
Max Bajracharya
-In a newer view of child upbringing where the home and society have different
rules, when does a child actually realize that the home and society are
different systems with associated rules? How does a young child realize
which system he participates in? Is one system a subset of the other (which
creates which?)?
Joseph Kaye
-Overwhelmingly, the question is one of educating the parents. The fundamental
change that Spock proposes is not educating children that what is private
should not be made public, but educating the the parents that what is
public need not be the totality of privacy. We are seeing the change from
a generation that has near-equated their private behaviour with what is
publicly acceptable, to one that must be warned not to equate their public
behaviour with their private.
Mike Ananny
-Jenkins states that the Gessell Institute argues that parents should
"act to interrupt and redirect these erotic impulses into more acceptable
objects [...]" Isn't this really an example of Freudian sublimation? How
much of Freudian sublimation is really controlled by the parents? I.e.
the child may be a closed system (a "steam engine of intensity") but perhaps
the parents control the valves?
- Jenkins traces the history of the last sexual revolution for children
and adults. Can we speculate on what the next sexual revolution will be?
What are current attitudes toward childhood sexuality that are still taboos?
-Jenkins states that the prewar paradigm was grounded in behaviourism
(emphasizing that it is impossible to study internal mental life through
scientific observation). How would a behaviourist address Freudian theories
of sexuality? Do Freud's theories still hold true because they are based
on drive states that are fundamentally innately biological (in accordance
with the behaviourists nativist ideas) or would Freud's whole idea of
a personality based on Id, Ego and Super Ego be impossible because it
presupposes the existence of an explicable internal conscious (not possible
from a behaviourist approach)?
Shaida Boroumand
-How does a "permissive" upbringing affect how that child ultimately raises
their own children? Was there a backlash against this kind of childrearing?
Anindita Basu
-Doesn't prohibiting a child from doing something make the action more
desirable because it is forbidden? Rousseau would say that if boundaries
weren't set, the child would not know that there was something to transgress.
-What kinds of adults result from permissive parenting as opposed to authoritarian
parenting? Do generations tend to be more conservative or liberal depending
on how their parents raised them? Do generations tend to alternate with
respect to parenting styles, eg is there some sort of backlash against
the parenting styles with which they were raised? The permissive parents
rebelled against their authoritarian parents. Did the children of permissive
parents in turn become more strict and disciplinarian with their children?
What is the current prevalent parenting style according to child-rearing
literature?
-Despite permissive parenting, there was a large youth rebellion in the
60s. How did this happen?
Jennie R. Ben-Hain
-It seems to me that the postwar ideas are entirely a reaction to the
rigid upbringing these new parents were subjected to as children. How
are people who were raised this rigidly able to have a basis to be so
free and expressive with their own children? And wouldnt the reverse happen
in the next generation? Sort of like hippies raising a Future Yuppie of
America?
-The idea of producing children who can be interchanged as "cogs" in the
Assembly Line of life really makes me uneasy.
Carlos Cantu
-Is it possible to predict when this "backlash" will end?
Girim Sung
-How did the courts deal with Leo? Has a line been established between
sexual openness and sexual molestation?
-Jenkins says "what Spock didn't tell us, however, is that adult sexuality
is also taking shape in relation to children's sexuality, that mothers
and fathers were responding to this changing definition of children's
erotic urges and using them to justify a fuller range of erotic expression
for themselves." This idea really fascinated me that both the adult and
child are learning about sexuality simultaneously. In a sense, the adult
has returned to a child-like state of exploration and testing personal
and societal boundaries. However, this exploration seems to be confined
to the child's sphere. When parents talk to other parents, there is more
"impulse toward restraint and regulation." So this made me wonder: why
is it that only children are allowed to explore and adults are expected
to stay within limits? It is interesting that when adults are raising
children and in the children's sphere, adults are encouraged by Dr. Spock
to explore and to be uninhibited. But once they step out of this sphere,
there is only repression by tight societal boundaries. If these boundaries
are so corrupting for children, why do we even have these boundaries in
the first place? Why are adults rejecting the very rules they themselves
uphold, when raising their children?
Melanie Wong
-How did American child experts transition their thoughts about early
child care after the war? Why did they suddenly abandon their principles
and cling to affection?
-Child rearing went from Louis XIV being a "sensuous child" to a period
of control and lack of affection to post war's principles on nurturing.
Will American society ever revert back to the controling thoughts of child
rearing?
Daniel Huecker
-There is an important dynamic between how "child specialists" view the
sexuality of the child and how the adults view themselves. Could these
theories be an attempt to correct the "sexual dysfunction" of the parents
by making the next sexual generation better prepared for adult sexuality?
Jennifer Chung
-During the sexual revolution, the way of thinking which said that children
should be comfortable with their sexuality -- is it possible that this
is an example of 'treating children like small adults'? It's a bit of
a stretch, but the case is possible. Meanwhile, I was eerily reminded
of Louis XIII (?) and the Aries; although cruder, and I don't know if
Spock would have considered the future monarch to be well-adjusted, there's
that similar air of sexual liberation. Then again, the contexts are different.
Stephanie K. Dalquist
-Again, I wonder about the sort of experience that Watson, Salk, and Spock
have had with children. Their ideals do not seem as questionable as those
proposed by Rousseau, but I am wondering if they got a chance to raise
children in these methods, if any actual child-rearing experience has
changed their ideals/opinions/methods at all.
-Is there any way that children's sexuality could *not* take shape "within
the context of adult sexuality... erotic urges, rivalries, and inhibitions"
(p223)? Adults not only have more experience, but more interest in understanding,
making an understanding of children's sexuality free of the context of
adult sexuality impossible!
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