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1. Erik Erikson, "Toys and Reasons"
Stephanie K. Dalquist
-In any of his writings, does Erikson consider play for purposes beyond
identity and therapy? -What about play as a means to develop social interaction,
cognitive processes, or activity skills? Also, Erikson has one of the
most widely-known development theories.
-Does he ever connect this to his theory of play?
Michael Dowe
-I have to disagree with Erikson's view that American schools "overly
[encourage] children of mixed backgrounds" with a "spirit of self-reliance
and enterprise."(p245) Schools are entrenched in a system of associating
"American" with "white." Minority groups are shown through cultural icons
(the Red Rider example, Santa, Jesus) that they're different much sooner
than erikson's "identity vs. role confusion" stage.
-So i guess my question is: what's the difference between the budding
"identity" and the "milieu?" Maybe my reading of the milieu is incorrect,
but it seems that identity is fostered by the milieu, a litany of adult's
expectations and reinforcements (whether positive or negative) based on
their own "grown up" identities.
Hilarie Tomasiewicz
-Toys and reasons: "He thus indicated that in setting fires he fantasized
being a bombardier like the father, who had told of his exploits." (239)
Could the majority of "dangerous" play be the result of children trying
to act prematurely as adults - primarily like their parents, for instance?
Max Bajracharya
-How do dolls play into a child's life? In Mary's case, there were points
when she seemed to see herself in the doll, but other's when it was simply
treated as an object (pushing things around).
-Do children actually consciously see themselves in the doll? Or is it
something that is implied but not understood (because of a lack of that
abstraction capability at that age)?
David Spitz
-How does Erikson make the jump between the influence of the family and
that of society? How does race factor in?
Char DeCroos
-Is repitition compulsion motivated by motivated by desiring some sort
of resolution to the negative experience?
Jeannie Ben-Hain
-There is an example in the text about how a Cheyenne boy's efforts at
helping the family's hunt are continually rewarded equally with the one's
of the father. Does this relate at all to the idea that children mostly
engage in play?
-He is given a set of toy bows and arrows at a young age, but is expected
to have the same responsibility as his father. yes, this helps him gain
recognition for his accomplishments but is it at the sake of his play
time?
Walter Dan Stiehl
-From the passage on the "psychological description of Ben from Tom Sawyer,"
why must play always be analyzed?
-Can play ever be just that play and fantasy without a psychological motive?
Can it be simply just stress relief?
Carlos Cantu
-In response to pg. 222 "...child's play is the infantile form of human
ability to deal with experience by creating model situations and to master
reality by experiment and planning."
Girim Sung
-In the example on page 216, Erikson writes of Freud's observation of
child playing a game of disappearance and reappearance. Freud interprets
the child discovering his reflection; He says that by the child playing
"going away from himself and returning to himself," the child has become
the master of the situation. Erikson goes further to explain that this
child plays with his reflection to deal with his mother leaving him. "He
is now both the person who is being left and the person who leaves;" in
that way he can control who is leaving in his "play" world. However, instead
of subconscious emotions, could this child simply be exploring Piaget's
concept of object permanance? Could this child's interest in reflection
be a phase in cognitive development, not some subconscious realization
of the feeling of abandonment?
Anindita Basu
-Erickson describes play as an environment of simulation in which a child
creates model situations and then experiments with possible solutions.
Sherry Turkle and Dan Tapscott speak of the Internet in similar terms.
How do the two ideas relate to each other?
-What are commonalities and differences between Erickson's description
of play and Turkle and Tapscott's descriptions of interactions on the
Internet?
Melanie Wong
-Although Freudians exist today, I believe that he is not well recognized
in modern psychology. However, are Eriksonian principles used by contemporary
child psychologists. Would a majority of child experts laud this piece?
Chris Eastburn
-"Under favorable circumstances children have the nucleus of a separate
identity early in life; often they must defend it even against the necessity
of over-identifying with one or both of the parents." Is this original
identity the result of a natural (i.e. genetic) formation or is it the
interaction with society in early childhood?
Raffi Krikorian
-what happens to only children? what happens when the child is not brought
to interact with other children (out of situation -- perhaps being on
a farm)? when the child's only playmate may be an adult figure, how does
that help/hinder development?
Petra Chong
-I had rather a strong reaction to this. The whole description and analysis
of Mary's play smacked of fortune-telling to me. I found his desire to
correlate such events as dropping of the doll from waist height with a
fascination with male genitalia slightly abhorrent. Why does Erikson assume
that everybody has a fascination with genitalia, male or otherwise?
-For all we know Mary could have done it because she liked the sound of
the doll hitting the floor. This seems like numerology -- anything can
be made to mean anything else if we look hard enough. I would be extremely
wary of sending my child to see such a doctor.
2. Erik Erikson, "Eight Ages of Man"
Stephanie K. Dalquist
-A lot has been made over the choices of Erikson's progressive 8 stages
of development and their almost exclusive application to male development.
Has the similar issue of the overall difficulty of reaching "maturity"
ever been widely discussed? Is there any specific reason that Erikson's
stages cannot be tackled concurrently? (like Alderfer's Existence-relatedness-growth
thory of needs, where more than one could be tackled at once, as a modification
of Maslow's inflexible hierarchy) Ages are rarely mentioned in this text.
For purposes of comparison, where should the children (Ann & Mary) of
"Toys and Reason" be in development?
Hilarie Tomasiewicz
-"Too much shaming does not lead to genuine propriety but to a secret
determination to try to get away with things, unseen." (253) In what ways
is this notion of adult as sower of bad habits related to Rousseau's belief
that adults and teachers effectively "instruct" children on how to lie?
Max Bajracharya
-Talking about role confusing, Erikson mentions youths overidentifying
with cliques and crowds; it seems like one would need a good handle on
an identity to break free from this problem. What mechanisms allow the
growth away from this stage?
David Spitz
-Erikson's teleological approach, evidenced by his assumptions about heterosexual
partnerings and "generativity," recalls the challenge put forth by Kessen
-- namely, can we envision another approach that is not so proscriptive?
Char DeCroos
-Is it true that all religions have in common a "childlike" surrender
to something?
-Take Buddiism and it's very mature acceptance of all reality as suffering.
What is the difference between adult surrender and childlike surrender?
Jeannie Ben-Hain
-I found it interesting that religion is brought up as the key way parents
use to teach their children morals and that there is a meaning to their
lives. What then are children to learn from parents who are atheist and
how do the different religions succeed/fail to teach a child these lessons?
Walter Dan Stiehl
-Where do modern interactive dolls fit into the idea of initiative vs.
guilt? If a child has a doll which is incredibly lifelike, how does this
affect their development at this stage.
-Is it better for a toy to give a realistic response or to allow for the
child's view of what a response should be in the form of play parenthood?
Carlos Cantu
-What kinds of parallels could one draw between US contemporary culture
and this "8 stages of man" model?
-Personally, I'd speculate that we are are somewhere between an adolescent
-As a nation we are still having trouble finding a national identity and
we are still trying to prove to ourselves (time and time again over the
past 150 years or so) that "those who succeed in their anticipated adult
world thereby shoulder the obligation of being the best"(pg263).
-If any country has a "distantiation" problem it sure as hell is the US.
We are always ready to isolate ourselves from those who tread on our turf,
although they may have been our friends just a while ago (Saddam was our
friend once). We (as a national entity) experience, as Erikson states,
all of our intimate, competitive, and combative relations with the same
people. What then will is take to bring the US to the so called "Utopia
of Genitality" if so many other countries are maturing at different rates?
Girim Sung
-Erikson briefly talks about disappointment when discovering that the
parent who disciplines you is not exactly a model of angelic perfection.
Rousseau also advises that parents need to lead by example, not by words.
How do children deal with this realization that the parent who has been
on their moral pedestal makes human judgements too?
-Some parents say, "do as I say, not as I act"; perhaps this teaches children
to know the ideal, but to try to translate ideal into reality?
Anindita Basu
-How do Erickson's stages compare to Freud's? Erickson at the end of the
chapter maps a few of his stages to Freud's stages, but how close are
the theories?
-Is it possible to later correct for problems in one of the developmental
stages? Similarly, is it possible to skip a stage either in part or entirely
or are the stages strictly sequential?
Melanie Wong
-Erikson uses the term "ego" frequently in both chapters. What is meant
by this term? I feel as if this word symbolizes different aspects in different
passages.
Chris Eastburn
-Is the body part of the psyche or the environment, or does it have a
special position between the two?
-or what is the relationship between body ego and identity?
Raffi Krikorian
-where does bravado fit in? we have autonomy vs. shame and doubt, we have
trust vs mistrust, but where does a child learn bravado?
Petra Chong
-Why is there this need to put some sort of deep meaning to every action,
every phase of childhood? I see Erikson's writing as being similar to
Briggs in spirit. I did react similarly to Briggs' need to ascribe deep
meaning to the play between Chubby Maata and her relatives (less strongly
though, because there was less fascination with sex in the Briggs aritcle).
Hmm. Maybe this is because I myself regard sex as something not quite
appropriate for children. What an interesting inference.
3. Lev Vygotsky, "Tool and Symbol in Child Development"
Stephanie K. Dalquist
-Why was it anticipated that the development of practical intelligence
and speech be dependent?
Hilarie Tomasiewicz
-"The path from object to child and from child to object passes through
another person." (30) How, then do some experimental psycologists believe
that a child's questioning (the child's speech) of an adult ("another
person") is completely unrelated to that child's understanding of whatever
was in question (the child's practical intelligence)?
Max Bajracharya
-Vygotsky seems to argue that children actually learn to abstract concepts;
they evolve to the sign/symbol relationship, learning language and how
to symbolize abstract concepts. Is this simply an extension of the earlier
notion of perception leading directly to action, or is it something fundamentally
different?
David Spitz
-Does this argument carry the assumption that different languages engender
different cognitive responses?
Char DeCroos
-Is repitition compulsion motivated by motivated by desiring some sort
of resolution to the negative experience?
Jeannie Ben-Hain
-I think that some adults still use the process of talking through a process
to help them figure out what needs to be done. Children do tend to use
this process more frequently however. Could the reason for this be because
we tend to think about speech in the same way we think about actions?
Walter Dan Stiehl
-Vygotsky stresses the importance of speech to children solving problems.
He even goes as far as to say that children who are not allowed to speak
cannot solve the problem given. Is this still true in cultures that repress
speech in children?
Anindita Basu
-How do Vygotsky's descriptions of tools and language development relate
to what he said about children playing with objects?
-Do similar kinds of speech and thought development occur in play situations
as in task-oriented situations?
-Do play situations become similar to task-driven situations with the
emergence of rules?
Melanie Wong
-I first laughed out loud when I read the line, "He compared the study
of children to the study of botany..." But, as I thought about this more,
it may not be too far off from modern parental thought. This goes with
a line in Erikson's "Toys and Reason", in which cognitive dissonance exists
between work and play. Will the majority of society ever acknowledge that
children have reasoning abilities and are not just delicate toys or plants
to be watered?
Chris Eastburn
-Would Rousseau accept the importance of language in the child before
12 if he had defined it as Vygotsky does?
-or is there still too much assumption of "reason" on the child's part?
Raffi Krikorian
-The use of egocentric speech seems like a valid theory when children
are alone or the siblings in the family are of a large age difference,
what happens when two children are kept in contact for a long time? does
the use of egocentric speech diminish? do the children view each other
as "tools"?
Petra Chong
-Is spoken language necessary for planning of actions to occur? I would
imagine that deaf-mutes know how to plan actions. Is what's required not
so much spoken use of language but the concept of language (symbols representing
things in the world)?
4. Lev Vygotsky, "The Role of Play in Development"
Stephanie K. Dalquist
-If (p.93) "things dictate to the [quite young] child what he must do,"
what is it still "things" in older children? Has there been determined
an approximate age/developmental point at which this changes? Where does
symbolism depart from the "reality" of a stick horse? I was one of those
kids who, honestly, did imagine a postcard as a horse. It had a big 2-dimensional
trunk, and by landing the front corner before the back, I could make it
gallop across the table. "Symbolism" as it used in literature may be above
a young child's complete understanding, but I fail to see the difference
between the stick's and the postcard's ability to be a horse.
Hilarie Tomasiewicz
-"The vital dirrerence, as Sully describes it, is that the child in playing
tries to be what she thinks a sisiter should be." (94) Is Sully, then,
implying that a child has a definite awareness of conscience and that
it directly shapes her play? Are we to believe that children play like
they are "supposed" to act?
Max Bajracharya
-Vygotsky observes that "children solve practical tasks with the help
of their speech , as well as their eyes and hands." But isn't speech simply
a verbalization of the capability to abstract concepts into symbols?
-So in a sense, it's a child's ability to think in symbols which is helping
them accomplish their task. But how does verbalization help this cause
(does it just force its use)?
David Spitz
-While play is obviously a good thing for Vygotsky in so far as it "contains
all development tendencies in a condensed form," would he say there are
drawbacks to too much play?
Char DeCroos
-It is said in the article The Role of Play in Development that around
the pre school age a great many desires and tendencies emerge. These unrealizable
tendencies continue till adulthood. Do adults just have fewer unrealizable
tendencies, or do they just preform a more effective job of compensating/sublimating
them?
Jeannie Ben-Hain
-How does the view that children are constantly working out their problems
through play conflict with Rousseau's view that children are not capable
of reason?
-How does imagination and play fit into the way he would have brought
up Emile?
Walter Dan Stiehl
-If a "postcard cannot represent a horse" in a child's play pattern, how
can children pretend that a He-Man character is now some other person
(as children of my generation did)?
-Is a materialistic licensed property (such as a Mighty Morphing Power
Ranger) identified in a similar way i.e. can a Mighty Morphing Power Ranger
ever be used in play as anything but a Mighty Morphing Power Ranger?
-Has the materialization and licensing of the toy industry with movie
and television tie-ins severely limited the range of Children's play?
Girim Sung
-Vygotsky seems to be agreeing with Erikson that "the playing child advances
forward to new stages of mastery." Through play, a child explores functions
of concepts outside the "rules." Was this philosophy the basis of children
being allowed sexual freedom in Louis XIII's time--it was okay because
adults separated play and reality--children were "playing"? (the adults
impose their division of play and work on the children, who saw no division
between play and work)
Anindita Basu
-Erickson initially indicates that play should be lighthearted, with no
fear of consequences. Vygotsky seems to immediately reject this idea with
a more intense and complex notion of play. Is there some sort of middle
ground between the two?
-Can parts of their respective theories on development and play be made
to fit together?
-What are the desired end results from the two perspectives on development
and how do they relate?
Melanie Wong
-How can play exist with so many implicit rules? Doesn't the idea of rules
incorporated in play seem ironic?
Chris Eastburn
-A divergence between the fields of meaning and vision first occurs at
preschool age. What are the initiators of these changes?
-Is it the physical development of the child? the social experiences?
Raffi Krikorian
-this paper constantly talks about how play helps in the intellectual/emtional/physical
development of a child. does that mean that play is not important when
people are older?
-is the rule-based playing no less important? is it simply a change of
pace for the "adult" world?
Petra Chong
-I agree that child's play does not always give pleasure to the child.
However, after reading this article I still do not know what play "is".
Why do children seem to need to make-believe during play?
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